fuel pump? heeelp :(

[izza]

hey everyone

first off i apologise for diving straight in with a question, i normally avoid that at all costs but im seriously in need of some help!

iv got a V reg 1.2 16v corsa felly, i think its a merit (its just a cheap run around while i get something else so im not hugely sure) and its now sitting abandoned a few miles from my house, and has been for a few days.

to avoid a 3 page rant il try and keep it brief - the problem appeared completely out the blue and started with it taking 3 turns of the key one morning a few weeks ago. few days later it just plain refused to start after it had sat overnight, then again the next morning, i live on a hill and the car bump started no problem on both occasions and continued to run fine the rest of the journey and i turned it on and off several times no problem after the initial bump.

the starter motor had been making a weird whooping noise occasionally after it was switched on (cold or warm) so i grabbed a new one from a scrappies and had it switched over by a mate, seemed to do the job. but a few days later it did it again then about a mile along the road i got a 'poo ur pants' stutter from the car (maybe a misfire or air in the fuel or sumthin?) and then another 100 metres or so it completely died as if i had turned it off with the key and it needed bump started to get it running again.

after a bit googling i decided to try a new fuel pump relay since it had been clickin away above my right knee big style while it was trying to turn over and after it cut itself out the relay ceased to make any noise apart from sporadically clicking during my hasty and rather jerky retreat home. i got 3 from a scrappies the next day, came home and low and behold the car turned over first turn without touching the relay, changed it round regardless and it turned over again.

2 days ago i went out and had to bump it much to my huge disappointment thinking id fixed it, and it again died on me lke before after about 20 minutes, this time however it refused to bump start - coming off the clutch in second just made the engine give a weird RRRRRRRRRR noise iv never heard. it also wouldnt start with jumper cables and now its sitting in a dodgy street a few miles away with the tax expiring in a day or 2 :/

i dont kno if its worth noting, but my exhaust vacated the premises a couple of months ago and took a gash of my fuel lines with it. it sat for a while in my drive until i did a fairly respectable patch up on the damaged pipe (one of the non high pressured ones apparently) by cutting the damaged 6 inch section out and replacing it with a bit wire woven piping and a few jubilee clips. the car has been fine for weeks since and there was no leakage underneath it.

im hoping someone can pin point a strong possibility to avoid throwing anymore money at it, its got 126k on the clock so im under no illusions of how it should b running, just would rather avoid spending £xx on more pointless repairs!

thanks in advance

iz

[haydn1987]

Have you noticed the engine management light come on whilst driving?
Does the light work (does it come on with the others when you turn the ingnition on)?
You can do the paperclip test to see if any fualt codes have been recorded see link below
http://www.topbuzz.co.uk/info/fault_cod ... _codes.htm

How old is the air filter, fuel filter and spark plugs, I would replace these if they are old as theyre cheap.

It could be an electrical fault check the wires connecting to the battery sometimes the cables can corrode at the end inside the its plasitc sheath and you won't notice without a proper look. This could be why it would start from a bump but not from turning the key but also could be nackered battery.
Also check the ground is secured and not corroded

To check the fuel pump is working lift up the back seats and put your ear to the floor while you get a friend to turn the ignition on you should be able to hear in whine. If it doesnt make a noise check the wiring if still no look replace the pump.

Check the condition of the spark plugs are they wet (petrol or oil)
If theyre dry try a bit of petrol down the holes if it starts then dies then no fuel supply.
If theyre wet (petrol) wipe then clean, remove fuel pump relay then with spark plugs still removed turn engine over for a few seconds then refit everything and try to start again.
if theyre wet (oil) wipe them clean and refit or replace.

Thats all I can think of I hope it helps

[izza]

hi thanks for replying

the engine management light hasn't come on whilst driving, but im sure it does light up alongside the usual suspects when you turn it over. i was about to nip out and check until i remembered its parked miles away haha

i did try to jump start it with leads incase it was a duff battery but no luck with that either, and its got plenty of power to try n kick back over when it dies so i wuldnt have thought its that although i wont rule it out.

do the pumps actually make a noise on corsas? in various other posts around the net iv read people saying the pumps r nigh on silent on them or they dont kick in until the engine turns over.

i will have a look at the plugs when i go down 2moro, i did think they were a possibility but the car ran a bit too smoothly prior to cutting out, and when the starters kicking its like its out of petrol which makes me think it is fuel starvation.

can anyone explain why the relay has stopped clicking or if it should even be clicking in the first place when its trying to turn over? before it died the first time u could audibly hear it above ur knee *click click click click*, now im getting nothing from any of the relays iv put in

[haydn1987]

try the paperclip test anyway, I you can't make sense of the flashes record a video and post it here

The fuel pump sould come on with the ignition, if I listen very carefully I can hear mine from the drivers seat but only for a second or two I think it goes quite once the fuel is pressurised.

I have never heard a clicking from my fuel relay I don't think it should make a noise. I would guess that it would only click when switching the pump on then click when swithing it off.

[izza]

il giv it a shot n see wat happens.

i used to b able 2 hear the pump priming in my williams quite audibly but certainly iv been listening since the problems started and havn't heard anything at all coming from the rear end but as i said i've read so many conflicting opinions about just how much noise a fuel pump should make in a corsa i didnt want to risk wasting more money on pointless parts.
is a fuel pump quite easy to access and change on corsas? i could get one around 30 quid on ebay and fit it myself if it is, im definately no mechanic but iv changed a lot of parts in the past, its just diagnosis that im not hugely up on!

a forum seemed the obvious place to start though i reckon having owned a couple of the beefier mk1 clios i kno certain cars have certain tendancies that with know-how can be solved quickly for a fiver etc, and u could spend days and £xxx trying to establish what the problem is. i guess this isnt too common a problem with corsas tho

[RenRenRen]

Replacing doesn't look too bad, you just need to fold the rear seats out the way and maybe pull back some carpet. Seems to be mostly prep in depressurising/draining the tank beforehand so you don't get fuel spraying everywhere.

The manual says you should be able to hear a buzzing from underneath the car when you try to start the ignition, but it will cut out after 2 seconds if the engine does not start. I can post up the relevant pages if you want.

[haydn1987]

I havent done it my self but its supposed to be an easy job as there is an access panel under the rear seats lift them up pull back some carpet and you will see a round black plastic thing pull it out and you can see the fuel lines. Its then a case of removing the fuel lines, a cover then unclip the fuel pump housing and then remove pump from housing.

I know what you mean about waste loads of time money replacing parts to find its something small and cheap that caused the problem.

[izza]

Replacing doesn't look too bad, you just need to fold the rear seats out the way and maybe pull back some carpet. Seems to be mostly prep in depressurising/draining the tank beforehand so you don't get fuel spraying everywhere.

The manual says you should be able to hear a buzzing from underneath the car when you try to start the ignition, but it will cut out after 2 seconds if the engine does not start. I can post up the relevant pages if you want.

if ur willing to take the time to post them then by all means

thanks for the replies guys, the tax expires 2moro so im gonna have to tow it back here 2nite, hopefully i can drag-start it and il b able to limp back without the joys of a pumped up servo haha

[RenRenRen]

Scanned huge so it's still readable, click the thumbs for the full pics. The 1.2 came in SOHC and DOHC, these are for the DOHC engine (Which I think yours is? To be honest I don't know what the difference is, electrical rather than mechanical is my area).

...


This is what you're hunting for under the seats, best of luck getting it home

[izza]

its aliiiive! haha, it bumped with a tow n i came home like sumin out the dukes of hazard speed bumps ahoy. was running really lumpy but no dramatic stutters like the twice before cutting out.

im probably gonna get a service pack for it n replace the fuel filter and plugs etc first, but 2moro il go out n see if i can hear the fuel pump priming etc.

thanks renrenren for that info!

[haydn1987]

Glad to hear you got it going

its less likely to be a fuel pump fualt if you got it going unless its an intermitent one. could just be a gunked up fuel filter.

[izza]

yea the fuel filter is my guess aswell tbh, i lifted the seat n got sumone to turn the key a few times n not a peep, not even a mouse fart from the shiny black cover of mystery ok so the relays making no noise, neither is the pump yet its running when bumped.

any new conclusions based on that?

tbh im at the stage where im debating jus punting it for spares, if nyones near edinburgh and is interested give me a shout. im thinking its potentially gonna now cost a fuel pump and servicing kit and still not be working. seems to b my luck!

[haydn1987]

A DIY service won't cost much I would start with the fuel fiter as that could be the answer.

Go around the engine looking for any wiring fualts, remove the shiny black cover of mystery and check the connectors for the fuel pump.

double check your fuel line patch

thats all I can think of

[izza]

thanks for all the help guys, gonna get a fuel filter n see what difference that makes. il keep u all posted